Which boat would be good for me?

[Crewman]

Hi All. I am new to boat banter and have recently sold my sailing cruiser" Tortola"a Westerly Fulmar 32ft. I am planning to change over to power and would like some ideas as to what to look for. The budget is no more than 25k and minimum length 29ft, 4/5berth for use mainly in the Irish sea. Must be fitted with economical diesels and have a cruising speed around 10knt+. Should it be a semi displacement hull? I have looked at the Princess 30ds. Does anyone have experience of this boat in a seaway I. e. Does the boat roll significantly? and will it cruise economically at 10knt with 2x 70hp engines.
Or should I go for a sports cruiser I. e. Sealine 290. I realise it will use more fuel but the journey will be completed quicker. Questions, questions,questions.

[Ianfs]

Hello Crewman and a very warm welcome to Boat Banter.

The 30DS is a great boat, I used to love them, but I think they were built with inland cruising in mind, patio doors and smaller engines etc. I'm not going to advise you though, only because I am in 2 minds myself at the moment, whether a single engine will get more use than a twin for economy etc.

What I would say though is the Sealine looks like a great boat, you may be able to get an S23 at the right price and also look at Sea Ray.

Bruce is the expert on the Irish Sea so any advice he can give you will be extremely useful.

[Crewman]

Thanks Ian. I had thought the Princess was more of a river cruiser myself. The more I look and the more I am coming round to thinking a planing hull is probably the way to go.

[ColinR]

On a boat of that size I would say twin 70s would be under powered at sea. It depends what you think is economical I suppose.

If you want to potter along at non planning speeds something like a hardy perhaps? Very seaworthy and stable boats.

Oh and welcome to our friendly forum.

[Ianfs]

Some thoughts to be going on with............

http://www.boatshed.com/rinker_300_fiesta_vee-boat-217736.html

http://www.boatshed.com/chriscraft_amerosport-boat-154720.html

http://www.boatshed.com/sealine_s23-boat-204373.html

http://www.boatshed.com/chriscraft_commander_410_-boat-127211.html

http://www.boatshed.com/cranchi_28_csl-boat-213600.html

[BruceK]

Hi. First off a semi displacement boat is the most fuel inefficient with very few plus sides. It's a common trend for those who migrate from yacht and motorsailers to go for semi and full displacement but the truth is that in the end they hold no real advantage over a deep V planing boat for a planing boat can cruise at hull speed just as efficiently. All powered boats you're likely to choose will be less sea kindly than a yacht and once off power will roll and pitch like a drunk in the Irish short chop. With a bit of power they stabilize quite well. For the Irish sea I'd be looking for a deep V a steep rise and a cruising speed of 20 knts with the capability to plane at 15 to 16 kntos easily. For fuel economy I'd be looking for legs over shafts. For 25k I'd look for single diesel at 28 foot circa 2005 or 34-37 foot twin diesel circa 1995. Boats that spring to mind are early Targa, Bavaria, S34 or S28. Id avoid the S23 like the plague. Excellent space utilisation but awful in the Irish Sea. Colvic do some good boats and of course you will get much more bang for your buck with American boats such as Sea Ray Formula Monterey and Regal etc. Whatever you do get diesel. Not because they're better but petrol is mostly unobtainable in the Irish sea and will severely limit cruising. I take it you are familiar with the Irish Sea? Avoid any boat which has a porpoise deck and or no rails. They're a liability in short chop which we get here. Other than that you haven't really given enough info to be more precise but if you pm me a number and times to call I'd be happy to have a chat.

[Crewman]

Thanks Bruce.Since I posted my request for advice I have looked at the Sealine 28S and 290. However I have been put off by the fuel figures. Having had a sailing boat for the last 12 years I have been used to using 1.5lts per hr and can not afford to run aboat using 20lrs per hr. Therefore reason for looking at semi displacement hulls. I take on board your suggestion of single engine for economy. I am currently looking at the Princess 30ds. However I am not sure what the cruising speed and fuel figures would be in the Irish sea as most of these boats appear to have been used on the Thames!

[BruceK]

As I said before a semi displacement hull is the most fuel inefficient. It is neither as efficient at displacement speed as a displacement hull and requires more force to get it to plane and so is less fuel efficient than a planing boat. You want to read the fuel stats for lifeboats. The only advantage of a Semi D is they are more sea kindly than a planing boat but not as much as full displacement. They work well with big boats of 50 and up but do not scale down well to the 30 foot range. A semi D really should be used mostly at hull speed with a sacrifice in economy to get it to a low speed plane, if it really planes at all. Remember a semi D can have a displacement or planing bias.
As for economy what you have to remember in a 30 foot displacement you may only achieve 7 knots efficiently but burn 6 litre an hour to do so. So to travel 70 nm will take you 60 litres. Now a full planing will cruise at 25 knts using 20l per hour, but it covers 20nm in just under 3 hours having used just under 60 litres. So tell me which now is more economical. (yes my KAD42's use 6 litres an hour on no load idle. i.e. neutral)

Next what you have to realise is the fuel economy graph is not linear with revs/ speed but logarithmic and describes a parabolic curve. So it may well suck 20l per hour at wot say 4000 rpm but say only 12 for cruising at 3200. If you go balls to the wall all the time you have to pay the fiddler, but rarely will you see top fuel consumption figures. Last year when I audited everything up, my fuel figures worked out at 2.7 litres per mile annual average.

Now the last word. Your fuel bills are actually the smallest percentage of running and maintenance costs over a year. If fuel is frightening you, then you really should be considering a return to sailing. Not that it's much cheaper either. And that you can take to the bank. I had a rough year last year and a lot of maintenance to do. My total budget is 12 grand a year all in (I hit 24.4 but I cocked up) of which 2 grand was in fuel or just £250 a month for the season used. Hardly a deal killer for the power boat hobby.
Also remember boating diesel prices are not forecourt prices either. I pay less than 80p a litre on a 60/40 split

[BruceK]

One final word. 20 knts in the Irish Sea opens it up to you. For instance I can go from Conwy to IOM for the weekend leaving Friday afternoon after work and be there 3 hours later, I could be in Dublin in 6. You couldnt sail or go displacement over a weekend. I can go down to the Lleyn Peninsula in a single tide. Yachts can take 3 days because they cannot make the tides at Conwy channel / Swellies and Caernafon Bar in any one tide swing. They take 3 days to circumnavigate Anglesey. I do it in 6 hours or so. What I am driving at is I am a sailing captain at my local club and I can hand on heart tell you power boats are used more often and go further afield than yachts because yachts are restricted to tidal whims. They can only pass over the channel 3 hours before and after HW slack. So what do they do? Forever go round in circles within the confines of Conwy Bay so they can make it back in before being cut off by the tide or gates and then once a year go on an extended cruise. Ok they beat us hands down there. But if you are a working schlebb, power and speed opens up opportunities you've yet to experience for impromptu unplanned trips out.

[Crewman]

Thanks for taking the time to advise.I understand all you have said and I feel the answer is probably a single engine, planing hull, running at less than 20knts.
Much appreciated.

Cheers Russ